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Thread: Proper move KQ on button shove

  1. #1
    WMD33 is offline Plankton

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    Proper move KQ on button shove

    I am an occasional player @ CSC. I participated a while back when BBP offered
    tournament play advice workshops. Was wondering if you could comment on my latest bust. 22 player tournament . 8 handed at final table. Blinds 800/1600 w 200 ante. 1 minute left in level before goes up to 1k, 2K blinds. I have 17K chips. Folded around to me on the button. I have K Q off. Figured I effectively have 8 BB and shoved all in. SB instacalls with pocket Queens, BB folds. I did not factor in that SB was chipleader. Didn't think it mattered. ANyone behind w pckt Q is going to instacall.
    Should I have been more careful? I didn't think I could raise to 4k with option of folding to re-raise from
    SB big stack or BB who was around 14k. I would have to call him anyway.
    Flop came K 10 Q, blank turn, 10 on river.
    Correct play, unlucky result?
    Seems like when I shove with KQ, KJ, K 10 when have 10 BB or less I often run into another
    player with AK, AQ, KQ vs my KJ, K10.
    Appreciate any comments you may have on my play.
    Thanks,
    Mike

  2. #2
    Chipless Wonder's Avatar
    Chipless Wonder is offline Honorary Member
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    Correct shove for sure in my opinion. Stacks in the blinds aren't relevant in this spot. Just an unlucky result.
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  3. #3
    LAPPIN's Avatar
    LAPPIN is offline Shark
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    this is an unexploitable shove with over twice your stack (see Scott Cook Main Event exit)

    With an M of 5, you can shove j9 profitably from the button

  4. #4
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    Goldnutz69 is offline Dolphin

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    Def must shove here. I'm pretty much shipping almost any two cards in this spot, which is kinda what Lappin has already said.

  5. #5
    Chipless Wonder's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by LAPPIN
    this is an unexploitable shove with over twice your stack (see Scott Cook Main Event exit)
    I thought of that, but decided not to rehash my tournament poker days.

    I busted from the 2009 WSOP Main Event open shoving 18 BB from the button with K-Qo when we were eight-handed. I have no regrets about this, and still believe that was the correct play.
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  6. #6
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    Easy shove. In local tournies, I allow myself to blind down below 10bb therefore, I tighten my shoving range just a bit. In your hand I am shoving a wide range though.
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  7. #7

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    Normal shove. Keep in mind a lot of the value from your shove is from the % of the time the opponent folds. If you let your stack get too small, then you lose the value gained from fold equity.
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  8. #8
    acdawg712 is offline Dolphin

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    KQo is a great hand in this spot. I'm shoving like top 50% with how tight calling ranges are, especially live.

    Quote Originally Posted by dyehard View Post
    Easy shove. In local tournies, I allow myself to blind down below 10bb therefore, I tighten my shoving range just a bit. In your hand I am shoving a wide range though.
    I agree with looking for a better spot live a lot of times, given people will fold after committing 50% of their stack sometimes. But if people are calling very tight, i think shoving wider is optimal. I haven't played too many local liveaments recently, focusing on cash, but given how tight people can be, I will be rethinking my strategy in the future.

    Quote Originally Posted by Chipless Wonder View Post
    I busted from the 2009 WSOP Main Event open shoving 18 BB from the button with K-Qo when we were eight-handed. I have no regrets about this, and still believe that was the correct play.
    Pretty standard in a high stakes tourney methinks, unless the blinds are just horrible players or something. It's def unexploitable and correct a large % of the time.
    Last edited by acdawg712; 03-13-2012 at 03:30 PM.

  9. #9
    WMD33 is offline Plankton

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    Thanks to those who responded to my original post. What I referred to in original post just happened again. 20 players left of 54 at NST friday tournamnet. I have 10 BB, shove A J offsuit from UTG +1, Instacalled by UTG +3 with AK and bust out again. If I am ahead of majority of hands per your posts, how is it 85%+ of time these situations bust me. I never suck out on anyone. When I get all in pair over underpair, I'm the one that gets sucked out by 2 outer.

  10. #10
    dyehard's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by WMD33 View Post
    Thanks to those who responded to my original post. What I referred to in original post just happened again. 20 players left of 54 at NST friday tournamnet. I have 10 BB, shove A J offsuit from UTG +1, Instacalled by UTG +3 with AK and bust out again. If I am ahead of majority of hands per your posts, how is it 85%+ of time these situations bust me. I never suck out on anyone. When I get all in pair over underpair, I'm the one that gets sucked out by 2 outer.
    Dont be results oriented. The thing about live poker is that variance could take a year or longer to work itself out even if you play live once or twice a week.
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